Wrestling with c1 cars

Forum dedicated to editing and modifying Carmageddon 1 & Carmageddon 2.

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Spectre2011
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Wrestling with c1 cars

Post by Spectre2011 »

Just for fun I tried to make a square shape without wheels and looked over the c2 car to c1 conversion tutorial as reference.
I actually got the model ingame, it just doesn't move,the other cars can phase through it, and max in the pratcam looks
like he's having a seizure.what should I do?
Last edited by Spectre2011 on Sun Jul 14, 2013 9:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: A question about wheeless\hovering cars in c1

Post by Toshiba-3 »

Sounds to me like you went too fast with C1 editing. Could be model not matching bbox or vice versa. Or the angular momentum proportions being too off.

So open your model in PT2 and take new coords for the bbox. If the txt file has any additional collision points, just remove them. Also pay attention to the ride height, and wheel positions. For the angular momentum proportions, just set them to width, height and length of the model for the moment.

Also the problem with that C1 tutorial is that it completely misses the ACTOR part of the setup.
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Re: A question about wheeless\hovering cars in c1

Post by Spectre2011 »

Thanks for the reply, anyway sorry I didn't specify the tutorial, it was Deep Blue's.
anyway, know any tutorials for that deal with angular momentum, bbox, and collision data?

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Re: A question about wheeless\hovering cars in c1

Post by Toshiba-3 »

Yes, I supposed you were talking about D_B's tutorial. Mastro's tut doesn't talk about ACTORS either anyway. There are almost no C1 tutorials :(

BBoxes in C1 are simple boxes defined by minima and maxima on each axis (-x,-y,-z then +x,+y,+z), it must be as close as possible to your model (or the collision your want your model to have).

This is what C2Scientist wrote about Angular Momentum Proportions in his Car Phys Tut:
Angular momentum proportions are based on the total width, height and length of the car. (x , y , z)

X:
This value affects to steering and "barrel-rolling". If this value is very high, the car will roll sideways very slowly & smoothly, maybe like it had some helium in it. (Unlike in the first picture)

Y:
This affects to barrel-rolling too, if you put a high value here.

Z:
This affects mostly to steering. And if the value is too high here, and you drive down from a rooftop, the car won't lean forward when there's not anymore ground under the front wheels. (Second picture)

Some values for different kinds of vehicles:
Kutter's Diablo: 0.40 , 0.22 , 0.77
Prop shafter (picture) 0.32 , 0.24 , 0.78
Pitbull's Big Dump 1.20 , 1.12 , 1.97
Limousine 0.44 , 0.32 , 1.41
Bus 0.60 , 0.64 , 2.60
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Re: A question about wheeless\hovering cars in c1

Post by Spectre2011 »

Thanks again, I'm still new to plaything2.
I'll keep this thread alive a little bit more just incase weird stuff come up during editing. :smile:

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Re: A question about wheeless\hovering cars in c1

Post by Deep_Blue »

Ah. Aside from the bbox thing-if I remember correctly, you still have to define the wheels (axis/position.etc.) but you don't actually have to make any.

'Lest that's what I remember doing.
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Re: A question about wheeless\hovering cars in c1

Post by CWR »

Not to take the nerd mytique off of this, but when I made one of the first hovering cars (Magic 8 Ball from Leadpumper) I simply used carmagedit to replace the wheel textures with index #0 color.

Image

I'm prolly misunderstanding the question.
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Spectre2011
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Re: A question about wheeless\hovering cars in c1

Post by Spectre2011 »

CWR wrote:Not to take the nerd mytique off of this, but when I made one of the first hovering cars (Magic 8 Ball from Leadpumper) I simply used carmagedit to replace the wheel textures with index #0 color.

Image

I'm prolly misunderstanding the question.
Its ok, the post title was misleading
anyway when I get around to it, i'm going to try making another car.
I probably fumbled on the wheel coords.

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Re: A question about wheeless\hovering cars in c1

Post by coffeycup »

What CWR is saying is you shouldn't even be fiddling with the wheel coords.
All you need to do is swap the wheel texture out with a transparent one.

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Re: A question about wheeless\hovering cars in c1

Post by Toshiba-3 »

His problem wasn't making the car look like hovering. It had a physic problem after importing a new model.
And Deep_Blue is right, if your car doesn't need wheels, there's no need for wheel models at all. Just remove the susp/pivot/spin grooves and their groovyfunkrefs and you're good to go. These are just visuals. The game will always process four wheel mechanics anyway.
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Re: A question about wheeless\hovering cars in c1

Post by Spectre2011 »

Sorry to resurrect an old post but, I got my thingie working in c1, how do I make the collision data fit my model? I mean it doesn't dent at all until you hit something at a high speed, then it looks like a crumpled mess of polygons.

Also again, sorry for the confusing thread name, it should of been called,
"how do I make a c1 car".

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Re: A question about wheeless\hovering cars in c1

Post by Deep_Blue »

"then it looks like a crumpled mess of polygons."

AAAAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!! (Sorry...couldn't resist)
Welcome to the club, Spectre!
:lol:

LOL. Origami cars. The C1 crush data is still kinda a mystery-
I hear tell there's guys here working on C1 crush data- how it works and maybe a CD generator eventually?

Maybe Tosh could tell ya more about it... There was a thread here once explaining some of C1 crush data, but it's gone, methinks.

Meanwhile as I understand it-a solution is to just delete the crush data. The car won't bend I don't think, but it won't look like a porcupine when it gets whacked, either!
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Re: A question about wheeless\hovering cars in c1

Post by Toshiba-3 »

Yeah it's possible to make crush datas manually but it's insanely complicated.

Just copy paste the crush datas of an addon car into your addon's text file :swink:
When will we see your item btw?

You can change the topic's title by editing your first post.
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Spectre2011
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Re: A question about wheeless\hovering cars in c1

Post by Spectre2011 »

Well that one I got working was a test, it was pretty much a distorted box with a texture and wheels. but I do have something in the works for c1
Image
Its loosely based off the ford escort van, the only thing really slowing me down
right now is learning how to mince together textures from car photos,
since I'm no picasso. yeah I know, I may need to tweak the model some more.

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Re: Wrestling with c1 cars

Post by coffeycup »

That looks cool. But I think you should split those 2 polys on the door left to right instead of up and down.
watchPolys.jpg
watchPolys.jpg (40.23 KiB) Viewed 10607 times

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Re: Wrestling with c1 cars

Post by Spectre2011 »

Thanks for the suggestion, I got that fixed, and soon I'm going to work on the textures.

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Re: Wrestling with c1 cars

Post by Deep_Blue »

Nice to see another somebody working on C1 goodies!
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Re: Wrestling with c1 cars

Post by Spectre2011 »

Well kinda bad news here, I'm stuck on this one stupid thing, trying to make the textures look realistic. I quit GIMP its too complicated now. though I did best with its 2.6 version. anyway the textures, as easy as they seem, they are going to take a while. : (

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Re: Wrestling with c1 cars

Post by Alex Self A 9 »

This forum kind of helps, thank you :smile:
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Re: Wrestling with c1 cars

Post by coffeycup »

Spectre2011 wrote:Well kinda bad news here, I'm stuck on this one stupid thing, trying to make the textures look realistic. I quit GIMP its too complicated now. though I did best with its 2.6 version. anyway the textures, as easy as they seem, they are going to take a while. : (
Well, I think you might be making a bigger deal than it is for a first car.

You can take a screenshot from within CarEd to get a side view and use that as a guide.
sample.jpg
sample.jpg (70.71 KiB) Viewed 10391 times
When you're happy with it, crop it to the edges and resize to one of these sizes:

256x256
256x128
256x64
128x128
128x64

like so:
sample256x64.jpg
sample256x64.jpg (32.01 KiB) Viewed 10391 times
You can save this JPG as a tiff and test it on your car.

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Re: Wrestling with c1 cars

Post by Spectre2011 »

Thanks, I should get a hold of myself, anyway after I made that post I whipped up some textures out of photos I'll fixem up and post them to see what you think.

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Re: Wrestling with c1 cars

Post by coffeycup »

Well, that's even better. Using photos of parts of real cars is a good way to go.
Looking forward to seeing what you come up with.

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Re: Wrestling with c1 cars

Post by Spectre2011 »

Ok here's what I have so far, its rough.
Image

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Re: Wrestling with c1 cars

Post by coffeycup »

That actually looks pretty dang good! You're on the right track.

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Re: Wrestling with c1 cars

Post by Toshiba-3 »

Looking good indeed, Spectre.
Still aimed at C1 thus? If so don't forget to check what your textures will look like with the C1 palette, as the final result might vary greatly due to color limitations.
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Spectre2011
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Re: Wrestling with c1 cars

Post by Spectre2011 »

I'm aware of the limitations, I have a cool program that can change texture bit.

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Re: Wrestling with c1 cars

Post by Spectre2011 »

Image
Image
Alright I got her fully skinned. tommarow I will work on the technical shit and see how it goes ingame. :smile:

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Re: Wrestling with c1 cars

Post by coffeycup »

Great first car, good luck getting ingame.

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Re: Wrestling with c1 cars

Post by Deep_Blue »

Nice one, Spectre.
Good luck!
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Re: Wrestling with c1 cars

Post by Alex Self A 9 »

Car looks cool, Spectre, keep it up, buddy :scool:
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Spectre2011
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Re: Wrestling with c1 cars

Post by Spectre2011 »

I got my car ingame but it jitters up and down when driven, as if there is jumping beans in the tires.

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Re: Wrestling with c1 cars

Post by Mad_Maxine »

I like it! It looks like a C2 drone heh,
I have the same problem ingame.. allso I cant even get my textures to work.

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Re: Wrestling with c1 cars

Post by Deep_Blue »

Aw snap...
I used to know what caused that..(jumping beans)
Hang on...It'll come back to me eventually.
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Spectre2011
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Re: Wrestling with c1 cars

Post by Spectre2011 »

Hey I might know what it is... I could try to move the wheels up a bit.
attempting now.

EDIT: nope that wasnt it, it starts out normal then does the same thing.

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Re: Wrestling with c1 cars

Post by Toshiba-3 »

It's because you need to do the physics correctly. The bounding box and especially the angular momentum proportions. The latter is likely too tiny.
Check this post again: http://www.cwaboard.co.uk/viewtopic.php ... 45#p101345

Also once again, just post your files if you want us to point out what's wrong directly and explain why.
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