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These last years, the CWA Board assimilated what was archived from many old Carmageddon forums, including the whole of the Official Carmageddon.com Forums.
If you wish to merge any previous account you might have had with your new or existing CWA account, don't hesitate to reach out to us !
Track Designin'
- random_monkey
- motorized monkey
- Posts: 2878
- Joined: Fri Sep 08, 2000 4:00 pm
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Track Designin'
The Destruction Derby 2 topic sparked something in me head just about tracks...
Just wondered what everyones ideal track would be like...
just draw something down on some paper, scan it in and post it
or do it on mspaint or something - just to see what everyones ideal track is
Just wondered what everyones ideal track would be like...
just draw something down on some paper, scan it in and post it
or do it on mspaint or something - just to see what everyones ideal track is
Re: Track Designin'
'k, sounds like a plan.
***When I die may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline***
- bruner_james
- The Dancing Bear
- Posts: 2016
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Re: Track Designin'
Heh! no scanner here, no drawing talent either, id be better off having a child make an artists conception for me! But anyways, I want is realism! No red tape bull crap sea world esque mumbo jumbo for me, something like Driver's 'frisco track is a start. Although youd have to cut 3 quarters of its size to make it fit into c2 ok.
Re: Track Designin'
Midtown madness 1's Chicago track. I know it's McLargeHuge, but damn! You can run flat-out on that sucker. Deathstreet came the closest to that. Even if none of the buildings had any smashable parts or insides. It'd still be righteous just for the area to cover.
I like any track where you can actually pursue opponents (or be pursued) and have time to maneuver to avoid/attack an opponent. That's why I liked the C1>C2 tracks by Errol and the bunch-lotsa room to run like hell.
Doesn't matter if it's a city based track or wide-open countryside/desert like I-76.
C2 tracks are too much like driving inside a parking garage-no room to haul ass.
Another thing I'd like to see is less ramp-y things. An incline to jump once inna while is good (who doesn't like catching air or landing weird?) but a bunch of steep inclines too close together immediately followed by 90 degree turns surrounded by walls is just a drag.
Sonuvabitch! I wish I had more time to commit to a track! I know they can get pretty big as I've expanded a couple of them to ridiculous proportions in PT2-some to the point where I had to resize them back down so they'd stay in camera range. (dunno how to change that either). So really big tracks (area-wise) are no big deal for C2.
I like any track where you can actually pursue opponents (or be pursued) and have time to maneuver to avoid/attack an opponent. That's why I liked the C1>C2 tracks by Errol and the bunch-lotsa room to run like hell.
Doesn't matter if it's a city based track or wide-open countryside/desert like I-76.
C2 tracks are too much like driving inside a parking garage-no room to haul ass.
Another thing I'd like to see is less ramp-y things. An incline to jump once inna while is good (who doesn't like catching air or landing weird?) but a bunch of steep inclines too close together immediately followed by 90 degree turns surrounded by walls is just a drag.
Sonuvabitch! I wish I had more time to commit to a track! I know they can get pretty big as I've expanded a couple of them to ridiculous proportions in PT2-some to the point where I had to resize them back down so they'd stay in camera range. (dunno how to change that either). So really big tracks (area-wise) are no big deal for C2.
***When I die may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline***
Re: Track Designin'
I always wanted to make a level, that would be a simple tunnel, but it would be long as hell. And it would be really really really long. So long, that you could go at such speed, that the framerate couldnt handle it. Unfortunatelly i dont know that much about making Levels for C2.
Re: Track Designin'
I made a real crap track for C2 without peds once using CarEd, PT2 and notepad, just to see if I could do it=it's not hard to do.
Getting the peds and drones and smashy stuff in is kinda beyond me tho.
Track making-especially a good, detailed track is a friggin' tedious process.
I just don't have the time to put into one that's really good.
Getting the peds and drones and smashy stuff in is kinda beyond me tho.
Track making-especially a good, detailed track is a friggin' tedious process.
I just don't have the time to put into one that's really good.
***When I die may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline***
- C2 Scientist
- jaywalker
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Re: Track Designin'
I can tell one thing: if you aim for a great track, don't bother with CarEd.
Re: Track Designin'
Yeh, well I can't model in anything else.
***When I die may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline***
- Lumberjack
- road raged psycho
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Re: Track Designin'
My sentiments exactly, DB! And what's wrong with CarEd anyway?
Edit: I forgot... the track I would like... I had thought of a novel idea, but I won't say that here as I'll probably make it someday. So, I agree with DB (again) in that I'd like something with a long road to get up some speed... and maybe also a racetrack to test handling, etc... you get the idea.
Edit: I forgot... the track I would like... I had thought of a novel idea, but I won't say that here as I'll probably make it someday. So, I agree with DB (again) in that I'd like something with a long road to get up some speed... and maybe also a racetrack to test handling, etc... you get the idea.
Re: Track Designin'
CarEd is no good cause its more of a car modeller/small objects obvliously, its not good for anything huge as you will have extreme problems zooming and such as the camera seems to be always targetted dead center. If you open up a regular c2 map in it, just try to zoom somewhere, its very difficult.
Wide open spaces are good, but it makes it sorta boring to me. Look at the airport level, it leaves nothing to surprise in the opponent department. You always see anything coming. I know lots of peoples favorite map is the airport, But heck everyone will like something different anyways. I say a track with a mix of what everyone wants would be the best way to go. I Only play on beaver city track and the junkyard level (I only like the "buisness district" part of the junkyard map, with all the 90degree turns, but its kind of small, and sometimes all the hills are tedius). I dont care for the rest of the levels and the only c1 map I liked is 'blood on the rooftops', but I dont play it cause the non cars are stupid and minimal, plus I cant stand the textures.
Mostly I like lots of 90 degree intersections so you can get into some nice blind realistic wrecks with cars (My most favorite!!) and lots of non cars (make new ones) is the best way to go.
I dont expect anyone to make a map though, there is a reason there isnt much in the track department - its simply far too time consuming and difficult. I say death street is the best fan made map, It could of been done a lot quicker I think, I forget who started it, but small block basically took over, and I think he took his time with it really or just didnt care to work on it all that much. But its a descent add-on fan made map. Savage elve made a good looking map, but I dont really find it much fun, its more of a nice scenery place if anything. No good chrashing really as there are lots of hills around that you tend to get stuck on a lot and so on.
Econos nukleen map is kinda good but its all kinda small (small buildings), I dont really like the textures either as they are mostly ones weve already seen before.
If anyones gonna make a map youve gotta think new and put a lot of effort. Make new textures, photoreal is the best way to go, you can find some good free textures on the web, or heck you can go out with your digital camera and take photos of buildings and stuff. New non cars is important, rather then taking ones that are already in the game, if anyone is serious about making a track id help anyway i can, Id love to model like a good 60 different new non cars and send em over. (hitting stuff is fun!)
Wide open spaces are good, but it makes it sorta boring to me. Look at the airport level, it leaves nothing to surprise in the opponent department. You always see anything coming. I know lots of peoples favorite map is the airport, But heck everyone will like something different anyways. I say a track with a mix of what everyone wants would be the best way to go. I Only play on beaver city track and the junkyard level (I only like the "buisness district" part of the junkyard map, with all the 90degree turns, but its kind of small, and sometimes all the hills are tedius). I dont care for the rest of the levels and the only c1 map I liked is 'blood on the rooftops', but I dont play it cause the non cars are stupid and minimal, plus I cant stand the textures.
Mostly I like lots of 90 degree intersections so you can get into some nice blind realistic wrecks with cars (My most favorite!!) and lots of non cars (make new ones) is the best way to go.
I dont expect anyone to make a map though, there is a reason there isnt much in the track department - its simply far too time consuming and difficult. I say death street is the best fan made map, It could of been done a lot quicker I think, I forget who started it, but small block basically took over, and I think he took his time with it really or just didnt care to work on it all that much. But its a descent add-on fan made map. Savage elve made a good looking map, but I dont really find it much fun, its more of a nice scenery place if anything. No good chrashing really as there are lots of hills around that you tend to get stuck on a lot and so on.
Econos nukleen map is kinda good but its all kinda small (small buildings), I dont really like the textures either as they are mostly ones weve already seen before.
If anyones gonna make a map youve gotta think new and put a lot of effort. Make new textures, photoreal is the best way to go, you can find some good free textures on the web, or heck you can go out with your digital camera and take photos of buildings and stuff. New non cars is important, rather then taking ones that are already in the game, if anyone is serious about making a track id help anyway i can, Id love to model like a good 60 different new non cars and send em over. (hitting stuff is fun!)
Re: Track Designin'
I have been slowly modeling a version of my home town of New Milford, CT... It's been in progress for a LOOOOONG time now-I'm using pictures taken of buildings and such with the digital cam.
Dunno when that'll be finished...
Dunno when that'll be finished...
***When I die may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline***
Re: Track Designin'
I gotta agree with ya on the wide-open spaces, auto. No fun to be able to see the bad guys coming from far away. I meant I liked tracks like the C1->C2 conversions where ya got winding roads and hills and stuff to block your view.
My ideal track would have some serious terrain-say, starting out on a mountain road, y'know-with a couple semi-sharp curves where if ya weren't careful ya could go crashing thru the guardrail and over a cliff-and this winding mountain road would eventually level out into some countryside where this road would get flatter with just some small hills to keep the sight lines obstructed over a distance-tree-lined roads for instance-mebbe a field or two with a barn or farmhouse near the road-and then leading to a small city with a business district to tear around in-or mebbe a small town with a green in the middle of it to destroy.
Kinda like the many New England towns here in Connecticut. This is why I've been slowly modeling my hometown-I've always wanted to raise hell on the streets here. We've got an old WW1 tank sitting on the green next to a gazebo that'd prolly be fun to destroy a' la "Dukes of Hazzard" with boards flying everywhere.
The thing with the existing C2 tracks that bugs me is that there's really no place to actually drive. It's too much 90 degree turns where there should be gentle curves and where there should be small inclines that smoothly go upward or downward-there's 45 degree angles that either bend your car or send you airborne. While catching air is fun-those angles are not realistic-if somebody designed a road like that around here-they'd prolly be hanged.
One of the things I like about parts of Deathstreet and some of the C1->C2 tracks is that there's areas od road where if yer racing in a pack and mebbe yer near the end of the pack and yer trying to bump yer way to the front-there's room to plan and execute a Pitt maeuver-like the cops do-when ya catch and hook the left rear corner of the car in front of you and send it spinning off the road or turn it so you're hitting it broadside-and then move up to the next opponent's car in front and mebbe swerve into him and sideswipe him-or as in the C2 intro movie where Max is alongside the blue car and swerving into the side of it a couple times. You need some fairly straight stretches of fairly flat road to do this.
A good example of room to drive would be the game "Demolition Racer" (which I just got about a week ago via one of those nasty, immoral warez sites) "Pitbull Speedway"-which is more than an oval- It's laid out more like some of the demo track in DD2. You can play 'cat-and mouse' with your opponents without having to worry so much about _____/ (bang!-holy shit! Where the hell did that come from?).
Roads that do _____/ are just no damn fun. And not very realistic either.
To me, THIS is driving:
As is this:
Not like driving up a set of damn stairs like in the junkyard level.
That and I just model the track in CarEd-'cuz I dunno how to use anything else. Then I export it as .asc and import it into PT2 to skin it and set up.
We sure could use some 2-way traffic as well-there's nothing like the accidental head-on collision at 100+ MPH after a slewing turn onto a sidestreet (as sometimes happen in MM when the cops are pursuing you and you're driving frantically to outrun them and misjudge what side of the road ya might end up on when ya round the corner.)
Too bad there's no cops in C2.
We could also use some drones that don't act like bumbling old hunting dogs on smack slowly sniffing around the track like they're looking for a good place to piss.
Drones that move with purpose and swerve to get the hell outta yer way, or that accidentally turn into you in a faster than catatonic state. Fun to have to dodge moving obstacles.
'Specially if there's lotsa them.
just my 2c
My ideal track would have some serious terrain-say, starting out on a mountain road, y'know-with a couple semi-sharp curves where if ya weren't careful ya could go crashing thru the guardrail and over a cliff-and this winding mountain road would eventually level out into some countryside where this road would get flatter with just some small hills to keep the sight lines obstructed over a distance-tree-lined roads for instance-mebbe a field or two with a barn or farmhouse near the road-and then leading to a small city with a business district to tear around in-or mebbe a small town with a green in the middle of it to destroy.
Kinda like the many New England towns here in Connecticut. This is why I've been slowly modeling my hometown-I've always wanted to raise hell on the streets here. We've got an old WW1 tank sitting on the green next to a gazebo that'd prolly be fun to destroy a' la "Dukes of Hazzard" with boards flying everywhere.
The thing with the existing C2 tracks that bugs me is that there's really no place to actually drive. It's too much 90 degree turns where there should be gentle curves and where there should be small inclines that smoothly go upward or downward-there's 45 degree angles that either bend your car or send you airborne. While catching air is fun-those angles are not realistic-if somebody designed a road like that around here-they'd prolly be hanged.
One of the things I like about parts of Deathstreet and some of the C1->C2 tracks is that there's areas od road where if yer racing in a pack and mebbe yer near the end of the pack and yer trying to bump yer way to the front-there's room to plan and execute a Pitt maeuver-like the cops do-when ya catch and hook the left rear corner of the car in front of you and send it spinning off the road or turn it so you're hitting it broadside-and then move up to the next opponent's car in front and mebbe swerve into him and sideswipe him-or as in the C2 intro movie where Max is alongside the blue car and swerving into the side of it a couple times. You need some fairly straight stretches of fairly flat road to do this.
A good example of room to drive would be the game "Demolition Racer" (which I just got about a week ago via one of those nasty, immoral warez sites) "Pitbull Speedway"-which is more than an oval- It's laid out more like some of the demo track in DD2. You can play 'cat-and mouse' with your opponents without having to worry so much about _____/ (bang!-holy shit! Where the hell did that come from?).
Roads that do _____/ are just no damn fun. And not very realistic either.
To me, THIS is driving:
As is this:
Not like driving up a set of damn stairs like in the junkyard level.
That and I just model the track in CarEd-'cuz I dunno how to use anything else. Then I export it as .asc and import it into PT2 to skin it and set up.
We sure could use some 2-way traffic as well-there's nothing like the accidental head-on collision at 100+ MPH after a slewing turn onto a sidestreet (as sometimes happen in MM when the cops are pursuing you and you're driving frantically to outrun them and misjudge what side of the road ya might end up on when ya round the corner.)
Too bad there's no cops in C2.
We could also use some drones that don't act like bumbling old hunting dogs on smack slowly sniffing around the track like they're looking for a good place to piss.
Drones that move with purpose and swerve to get the hell outta yer way, or that accidentally turn into you in a faster than catatonic state. Fun to have to dodge moving obstacles.
'Specially if there's lotsa them.
just my 2c
***When I die may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline***
- CarmaHolik
- turbo bastard
- Posts: 276
- Joined: Thu Sep 25, 2003 11:41 am
Re: Track Designin'
What kept you from doing so, Deep Blue?
I've always wanted to raise hell on the streets here.
I totally agree with you man. There's nothing more fun than fullspeed chases down a long 6 lane highway! That long road in the Deathstreet track is just perfect for such things!
Re: Track Designin'
Man, I LIVE here! Ya don't shit where ya sleep. 'Sides-ma 'repair' button is on the blink.
What kept you from doing so, Deep Blue?
That and it doesn't matter what ya got under the hood as far as the cops are concerned-ya can't outrun a Motorola
***When I die may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline***
- CarmaHolik
- turbo bastard
- Posts: 276
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Re: Track Designin'
Hehehe, you got a point there, I admit
- C2 Scientist
- jaywalker
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Re: Track Designin'
I keep collecting photographs of places that seem like they would be nice as Carmageddon tracks, from books and newspapers and travel agency advertisement books. The photos aren't necessarily showing a large environment, but even a short section of a bumpy road that looks interesting may be saved in my collection. In addition to that, I collect pictures of tunnels and bridges, for example... usually there's a road in every picture. I have about 350 pictures so far. I'm strange, am I not?
Re: Track Designin'
Not strange a-tall. There's the potential for all kindsa neat track settings in them thar pics. Models and skins as well.
All this track talk has got me inspired some...Mebbe I'll work on ma "New Milford" track some more tomite-what the hell-I've got a 3 day weekend. I s'pose I better chuck a new battery in ma camera and go find some more scenery, eh?
Ma town has got the Housatonic river runnin' thru the middle of it and a couple steel bridges over it...I need t' know how to make water act like water... They pull lotsa cars outta the river around here on a regular basis..
All this track talk has got me inspired some...Mebbe I'll work on ma "New Milford" track some more tomite-what the hell-I've got a 3 day weekend. I s'pose I better chuck a new battery in ma camera and go find some more scenery, eh?
Ma town has got the Housatonic river runnin' thru the middle of it and a couple steel bridges over it...I need t' know how to make water act like water... They pull lotsa cars outta the river around here on a regular basis..
***When I die may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline***
- C2 Scientist
- jaywalker
- Posts: 2059
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Re: Track Designin'
Water act like water in C2? What I remember from the time I was figuring out C2 track stuff, is this: Any texture, that has a "!" (exclamation mark) in its identifier, acts as a water 'surface'. That is, such texture will be nonsolid (you can pass through it), and when you go through it the physics are switched to underwater ones, until you go through that texture again. (Exit from underwater, or until you press "recover")
The texture doesn't even have to horizontal plane I think, I once put "!" to some bush-texture on a vertical plane, and I was driving underwater after that.
Still about that "!" in the texture: in PT2, you have the texture thumbnails with their names, the name has to have "!" before the actual name, so a texture called "Water" should become "!Water". Only then it will be a water surface.
The texture doesn't even have to horizontal plane I think, I once put "!" to some bush-texture on a vertical plane, and I was driving underwater after that.
Still about that "!" in the texture: in PT2, you have the texture thumbnails with their names, the name has to have "!" before the actual name, so a texture called "Water" should become "!Water". Only then it will be a water surface.
Re: Track Designin'
Oh, OK,thanks. Can't be bouncin' off'n the river now, can I? Now mebbe I'll sink like I'm s'posed to.
***When I die may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline***
Re: Track Designin'
hmm... the lower pick (the one whit a dirt track on), its Demolition racer... i got that game, some of the tracks would be good as C2 tracks... wonder if they can be converted in anyway
"One chicken in a thousand is hatched near a road. One in every ten thousand of those ever tries to cross it. Half of them are run over by cars."
- SoupaVedg
- motorised death
- Posts: 776
- Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2002 5:00 pm
- Location: Province de Québec, Canada
Re: Track Designin'
Well, those may be olds, but some of Test Drive 4 maps were really fun... Ok... I know they were linear, that you had to follow the route, but I really liked them... My 4 faves were: the Switzerland one with all of those curves and those tunnels... Plus if taken to C2, you could make it so you can actually fall from the cliffs(?) since this map was in a mountain zone... The German one, I remember it had a lot of long lines in which it was easy to get to the top speed of the cars, the England one, in which it was raining (sad that C2 can't make rain) and the last one the japan one, well, not really for anything except for the feeling of it...
Others maps that would be fun would be "micro machines" settings... A little bit like Econo's Garage map... There could be one in a bathroom, or another on the dinning table and things like that...I remember one level I liked in Micromachines on the old Genesis was the classroom one in which you had to drive on rulers to get from a desk to another or jump between two desk with the help of a strategically placed binder, etc...
Others maps that would be fun would be "micro machines" settings... A little bit like Econo's Garage map... There could be one in a bathroom, or another on the dinning table and things like that...I remember one level I liked in Micromachines on the old Genesis was the classroom one in which you had to drive on rulers to get from a desk to another or jump between two desk with the help of a strategically placed binder, etc...
SoupaVedg! The only super hero who have Soup in his name!
Re: Track Designin'
Hmmm...Cesm says weather is possible in C2-as are moving bridges like in MM and such.
What do you guys use to model tracks in?
What do you guys use to model tracks in?
***When I die may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline***
Re: Track Designin'
Anyone remember the Hotroom track? It was along those lines, a big, huge room with Hot Wheels style tracks to drive on and you could even drive up inside the walls! That was a fun one!
- random_monkey
- motorized monkey
- Posts: 2878
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Re: Track Designin'
I remember it, but the texturin' fucked up for me - so /everything/ was white... apart from some of the hotwheels track - it'd probably have rocked if I saw where I was going
Re: Track Designin'
Yeah, I remember that one-it was good once ya turned off alla the friggin' elephants.
***When I die may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline***
Re: Track Designin'
Yeah, the elephants and stuff were confusing, so I removed them as well. I've got a working version if you'd like it, Monkey!
- random_monkey
- motorized monkey
- Posts: 2878
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Re: Track Designin'
Nah, I'm 'cool' man
I'm not really that interested in tracks any more.
Quite the stupid thing to say after opening this topic, I know, but I'm a free willy and can say what I want.
I'm not really that interested in tracks any more.
Quite the stupid thing to say after opening this topic, I know, but I'm a free willy and can say what I want.
- Powdered Toast MAAAN!!
- 12 Cyl Symphony
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Re: Track Designin'
Yo Alan! You can shoot the track my way if you feel so inclined! I remember it and t'was fun!
[url=mailto:Wallace_deejay@blueyonder.co.uk">Wallace_deejay@blueyonder.co.uk[/url]
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- bruner_james
- The Dancing Bear
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Re: Track Designin'
elephants rock, you lot have no idea!
and anyone play SmashMap? I heard that was pretty kick arse, it had scripted sequences, ice that smashed, leaves falling from trees when you hit 'em, swinging bridges, loadsa stuff.
pretty swish
and anyone play SmashMap? I heard that was pretty kick arse, it had scripted sequences, ice that smashed, leaves falling from trees when you hit 'em, swinging bridges, loadsa stuff.
pretty swish
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Re: Track Designin'
elephants suck man!
- C2 Scientist
- jaywalker
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Re: Track Designin'
You just keep advertising the SmashMap, don't you? I wonder if anyone here still has it, I'd still like to check out that one.
DB: Did "bouncing off the river" mean that you could drive on the water without sinking? (You were Jesus!) If so, yes, you'll go underwater this time.
DB: Did "bouncing off the river" mean that you could drive on the water without sinking? (You were Jesus!) If so, yes, you'll go underwater this time.
Re: Track Designin'
Yeah, that's what I meant. Now it'll be a "Jesus" to get back outta the water-I don't think I made the banks shallow enough to climb out.
***When I die may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline***
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